We did this interview with Paimon on June 5th 2022. As usual, I put my wife into hypnosis and then summoned Paimon who spoke through her. Since Paimon is speaking through my wife he is speaking through her mind, so he uses her words and phrasing. Like all of these interviews we get answers that go against our expectations or beliefs.
This is the last of the first phase of what I am calling the Morningside Workings.
Jareth Tempest: Thank you for being with us King Paimon. We have some questions. Would it please your Majesty to answer them for us?
Paimon: It would.
JT: You are associated with the West, with Sagittarius, with both Venus and Mars, are you in a sense, the intelligence and energy of these astrological powers combined as they travel through the lower world?
P: In a sense that there’s one way of looking at it.
JT: So when we call a demon, it’s actually a celestial power as it travels through the underworld?
P: Yes and no. It is the celestial spirit as it travels through the underworld, but it is also its own thing.
JT: It becomes its own facet?
P: They are… two sides of the same coin. They are aspects, they are each other, but they are also distinct. If that…
JT: No that makes sense. So you didn’t rebel against your creator?
P: No, no. There’s no…In some ways, there’s no such thing as rebellion. It’s all woven into the fabric. You may think you’re bucking the system, but it’s part of this system. It’s just your role in that moment.
JT: Are chthonic spirits, being underworld spirits, more effective at influencing the human subconscious.
P: I think so. We understand the human subconscious better, and because of that, it is easier for us to work with them. There is a…We are subtext in the same way that the subconscious is. We are below the surface. We can relate to each other better, and I think that we are more in touch with human drives and emotions. We understand them better. We tend to see the worst aspects of people, the more raw aspects, the more genuine. Many of the angels and higher celestials they work with the best in you. We see as you are. They tend to see you as a more idealized version. They work with the best aspects of you. We have a tendency to see, and understand, the whole of humanity rather. They’re both important roles.
JT: Can we send you to influence another person against their will?
P: The key is “influence” here. Yes, I can influence. That’s not the same as force, I don’t. I don’t prefer to get my hands dirty and directly force an outcome, but arranged situations so that the person might see something from a different perspective. I can manipulate and maneuver. But it’s not guaranteed and I prefer not to use force.
JT: Can you influence a narcissist?
P: (Sighs) Sometimes. Yes, but it’s harder. You have to choose your moment, just right. Have the chisel ready to make a crack in their facade and sometimes you can get in, you can get an idea in but so much magic rolls off them like water off a duck’s back. It’s quite fascinating, the strength of will and how sadly misused it is.
JT: Would you say that narcissists tend to be new souls?
P: Somewhere in the middle honestly. New souls rarely… they lack. There’s a conviction… there’s a strength of personality that most newly fledged souls just aren’t… They don’t have that level of self-belief. But it’s also something that…
JT: So more like teenagers?
P: Yeah. Yes, not brand new souls, but not old souls either. They’re somewhere in the middle.
JT: Some rituals use celestial powers to constrain chthonic spirits, does this bother you?
P: I mean, it’s nice or to just ask, but I wouldn’t say it bothers me.
JT: What about how I typically will call the four archangels before just to set the stage almost. Is that the same or just is that ok?
P: Oh it’s fine. We’re all coworkers. We get along. We each have our roles and jobs to do, and we work together when appropriate. There’s no hard feelings. It functions for the purpose of a ritual, if that’s what the magician wishes. But they don’t feel particularly superior to us in our off time, we’re not subjugated.
JT: Why do spirits like you work with people?
P: People are fascinating. What else is there to do but drift in the ethereal void when we could come and play with the humans, taste your desires, help, or not, as the case may be.
JT: Some people talk about spirits appearing to them first. Do spirits sometimes pick people that they want to work with?
P: Absolutely. Frequently. Say someone is a particular… they’re in archetype, they embody the certain traits of a goddess or spirit that… there’s an attraction. Like attracts like. There are also bloodlines. Many spirits have long lasting relationships with ongoing communities of humans. Yes, yes, absolutely. We do from time to time pick a protege.
JT: Some people often think that there’s a negative cost for working with a chthonic spirit, is there any truth to this?
P: We’re not always easy or comfortable to work with. There’s no, there’s no dark cost. We don’t take something from you in return for our service, but we are underground spirits. Do you know, what happens underground? Things grow. We are growth. We are decay as well, but change, many of these things are painful, not for the faint of heart, and sometimes, you need to be broken down and rebuilt before you are ready for what you truly want.
JT: Is your personality the same for everyone, or are you different person to person?
P: We are always interpreted by the mind of the person that we are speaking to. We always use… We’re bound by the confines of what’s within their heads, their language, their… The way that they see us impact the way we respond to them. It’s a symbiotic relationship to some extent. And while there are some basic immutable facts. There’s also a fair amount of flexibility.
JT: You are said to be very loyal to Lucifer, is this because of astrological associations such as the West, or is I because of a real relationship between the two of you.
P: It is both. Because of our associations, we have enough in common to build a relationship. Our frequencies vibrate well together. We do have a good working relationship.
JT: Lucifer said that he created many demons or that many are different facets of him. Would that be what’s going on in your case?
P: Yes. And no. I… (struggling)
JT: Is fine…
Ligeia (waking up) I’m getting it. I’m getting a mental image of like if you have a thin slice of your rock break off you’ve got that facet and then another one and they become overlayed. So, he is a facet of lucifer overlaid or combined with some with… Almost like an energetic offspring, okay? Sorry, you want to take me back?
JT: Yeah, let’s go back. (Puts her back into hypnosis)
JT: King Paimon, do spirits interact, battle, and go on adventures with each other like in the myths, or are these just stories that try to explain something of your nature.
P: Yes, there are interactions and you might even say adventures. It’s… They don’t get picked up like they used to in the myths, but we are still active.
JT: So you do have lives in a sense, you know, beyond just what you do with us?
P: Well our lives are very intertwined with what we do with you. We spend time with you, you are the most interesting things. Most of the rest that are outside of the physical world seems… They lack the energy. They like the change. Things are… There are spiritual layers outside the physical, and the further you get from the physical, the more boring it gets. Humans are responsible for so much. The sparks, the life force that drives the universe, the energy that makes things interesting. The changes.
JT:: It is sometimes said that you work with the dead. Would you say working with your healthy ancestors to heal your unhealthy dead is the fastest, most effective method of healing your bloodline?
P: I would certainly. It was a fine art for millennia. Hundreds of thousands of years. It’s been lost, but not to the spirits. Don’t be afraid to recruit an expert. They will be happy to help.
JT: Are a lot of our social problems today being caused by the influence of unhealthy dead?
P: They’re certainly not helped. I think that most of the causes for the poor state of the world is down to mundane things. Down to human nature, but when you help a bunch of individual lives, it will inevitably help the society as a whole, and releasing the lingering anger and pain, being able to have well and healthy ancestors supporting… Certainly would make the world a better place and provide a better platform to fix the other problems.
JT: Can unhealed dead stop people from getting results from their magic.
JT: All right, and music is supposed to be one of your favorite areas, how can a musician work with you to improve their skills?
P: Practice. But don’t practice for perfection, practice for joy. Remember your joy in music. Don’t sing or play, don’t make music because it’s your profession, or your obligation, find the joy, find the passion.
JT: And would dedicating their instruments to you help?
P: I would certainly be flattered. And encouraged to lend my support.
JT: Just to kind of get your opinion on some things we’ve heard from others, would you agree that the best thing that someone can do to improve their magic is to grow and nurture their higher self and contact their holy guardian angel?
P: Provided they’ve already done the work of self-knowledge and generally if you if you are at that point you should have. And then having your head and heart in alignment, having your subconscious on board and, and being on the same page. You can’t be a truly successful magician if part of you is longing for failure or it doesn’t believe you deserve. So self-knowledge, self-awareness, and acceptance of your faults. All of those things are vital when going forth to try and encounter coordinate with your higher self and Holy Guardian Angel.
JT: You were said to know about hidden and forbidden knowledge so I’d like to ask you about some hidden things that may, or may not, be influencing the world.
P: Yes. All right.
JT: So we know that there are assorted saints and ascended masters who help us from beyond, but do they organize themselves into a White Lodge?
P: That term has a lot of baggage, I’m not wanting to give legitimacy to, but are they in touch? Do they, occasionally work together? Is there a sharing of information at least? They’re not an intricat team that works in tandem, but there is an awareness, and a helpfulness, and knowledge shared. Yes.
JT: So is there a black lodge of evil dead magicians?
P: There are those who do choose, call it the opposite path of the ascended masters that ascend into the light. They choose to embrace the darkest aspects and devolve into a black lodge for lack of better terminology. But there is a selfishness in their nature. They don’t have an agenda the way that the, I hate these terms, the white lodge is working forward toward enlightenment, betterment, connection to the divine. They aren’t a tightly organized group, but they do have sort of a… On the other side, there’s nothing, there’s no working together, they tend to be more beastial, almost their higher… sorry, I don’t know how to…
JT: That’s fine. I was not expecting much of an answer, so thank you for that. Okay, is their hidden cabal of child sacrificing leftist magicians, trying to rule the world in secret.
P: No, there are individuals who are awful, people who do bad things and sometimes they have enough power to full pull a few people into their bullshit, to act on their behalf, but the kind of organization, you know, it’s not a cabal of magicians just as likely to occur across any particular ideology. The world is more chaotic and less organized than most people give it credit for. People, by their nature, are difficult to wrangle and they can’t keep a secret worth a damn.
JT: Okay, is there a secret group of child sacrificing magicians, who worship Chronos, and have reincarnated into the same families time and time again, since ancient times that influence banking, finance, and push a far-right agenda?
P: You’re not entirely incorrect. Mostly incorrect. But there is some truth.
JT: Which parts? Let’s start with the do they worship Chronos who eats his children?
P: Not really. It’s evolved over millennia. I will say there are powerful wealthy and magically adept bloodlines who are active and have been. They’re nowhere near in control of the world, they are…
JT: But they’re wealthy and influential and use their influence to make things go their way, which tends to…
P: and there is a magical bloodline, and some structures that’s handed down.
JT: Okay. Are there organized Nazis, neo-Nazis, and white supremacist magicians using magic to push their agenda?
JT: And then is there a real Invisible College fighting to liberate humanity from these threats?
P: There are some who think that would be a good idea. Most of us understand that humanity needs to be under threat in order to survive. There’s…They say that it’s the journey, not the destination. It’s the fight. It’s not the victory.
JT: Well, thank you very much for being with us, great king. Is there any final message that you would like to give us?
P: Music is one of the most powerful tools. You have to move people just way their emotions to change events. It is among the most powerful magic that can be done.
JT: And so do spirits like music too, and it helps and influences them?
P: Oh yeah.
JT: All right again. Thank you and you may go in peace and love.